Appl 2003 Championship Suspended [Archive]

Cpt.Krunch

23-06-2003, 12:37 AM

The 2003 championship has been suspended due to circumstances beyond the control of the APPL or it's main sponsor and tournament promotor Action Paintball Games.

Australian legislation regarding the use and ownership of paintball markers and the playing of paintball games must be changed before a successful tournament scene can flourish. Whilst we have fractured and sub-standard laws that achieve nothing other than hold back a flourishing world sport, fly in the face of international and domestic public opinion, and most of all persecute people for playing a GAME. Pathetic behaviour in a so-called free society.

The APPL, with the help of Action Paintball Games, will now devote substantial efforts to call for an immediate review of paintball legislation throughout each state and territory in Australia. Included in this would be an mamnesty on ownership of paintball markers throughout all Australian Jurisdictions, and the immediate lifting of the import ban on an item the rest of the world considers leasure equipment, semi automatic paintball markers.

The APPL calls on all members of the paintball community to mindful at this time, and devote your energies to this task.

To the politicians and law makers we say,

We are not criminals.
We are you.

Let us play our game,

PAINTBALL.

APPL Committee

Shagga

23-06-2003, 01:12 AM

To get results we would need to show that we have numbers to back us, so how could ppl like myself make a constructive input to help this reveiw be taken seriously?

Bill

23-06-2003, 01:16 AM

I have had a long talk with JD tonight about the reasons behind this suspension of the APPL Tourneys.

I have come to the conclusion that in the circumstances thay have done what had to be done for the good of the series and indeed the sport in Australia.

I know that many of you will be bitterly disapointed that the 3rd round is now off, but please bear with them for a short while, the APPL will post their reasons behind this as soon as it is practical.

You may be called upon shortly for your assistance. I urge you all to put aside any grievances and spend a few hours of your time to do what has to be done.

Bill

23-06-2003, 01:19 AM

Originally posted by ShAgGaR
To get results we would need to show that we have numbers to back us, so how could ppl like myself make a constructive input to help this reveiw be taken seriously?
Hold tight Shaggar, more info on what can be done will be posted shortly.

Big Gav

23-06-2003, 08:53 AM

You have got to be F$%king joking. But it aint April 1st is it!

JJJ

23-06-2003, 09:03 AM

:( :( :cry: :cry:

CDG

23-06-2003, 09:21 AM

:( :( ....man this is crappy news for a Monday morning.....:cry:

Hope the APPL with everyones help can get the laws changed so we can be left alone to enjoy our great sport.

Knackers

23-06-2003, 10:02 AM

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :help:

Cpt.Krunch

23-06-2003, 10:26 AM

I wish it was April 1st Gav but it's not.

The worst news I think I have ever had to tell a group of people.
A kick in the guts.

This happens every few years. Big scare, dies down then comes back.

We've got to stop this happening.

Queenslanders call Alex McClean or Pete Martin and start to co-ordinate a balanced approach to deal with the inadequacies of QLD legislation e.g your incredulous 75cm minimum length requirement. Great for real guns, not needed for toys.

These are the things we need to do.

If you need any help from the APPL in the from of legal information and advice. Please don't hesitate to call. I can be reached at Action paintball on (02)9679-0011.

The time to dream about the possibilities is over. We need action and we can't stop untill we get change, no matter how hard it gets.

Heads Up
JD

CDG

23-06-2003, 11:25 AM

Hey JD,

After reading your message and being pissed off at the government and generally disappointed by the whole situation I was wondering what the little people out here in paintball land can do to help...?

Not much, but I figure joining the APPL might be a good start for those of us that haven't yet become members. (me included)

But the APPL wedsite seems to be down. Does it have anything to do with the current situation or just coincidence?

Can you post info about where we can get registration forms etc...

I urge all of us that haven't yet "got around" to joining do so ASAP...

Knackers

23-06-2003, 11:31 AM

This situation could be real bad for all of us. We need to do ALL we can do to help the ppl that are trying to help us as much as possible.

Join the appl if you havent already. & ask Jd if there is anything you can do to helpout OUR situation. I did that as soon as I phoned JD.

Cpt.Krunch

23-06-2003, 12:38 PM

I'll give the forms to Bill, so you guys can download them from Bills.

Cheers

JD

Cpt.Krunch

23-06-2003, 12:39 PM

BTW, the APPL site being down is pure coincidence.

JD

little bitch

23-06-2003, 12:51 PM

dats a bloody outrage it is!! betta tell the priminista, oooooooiiii mista priminista!!!

Electrofunkster

23-06-2003, 01:39 PM

Its a huge disapointment for all of us but please be reasonable and understanding that the APPL board is just doing whats best for everyone

P.S little bitch pull your head in..... hehehe :D someone had to say it

little bitch

23-06-2003, 02:40 PM

well i guess i will b able to save some money for once in my life, it is unfortunate,yes but i believe they made the best decision for all of us

BACKMAN

23-06-2003, 05:16 PM

:( :( :( :( man that sucks hard.but i guess if its 4 the good of the sport and all...just a question jd is it possible for u to tell us exactaly the reasons for the decision so that maybe we can prepare for any action we should take as members/playaz ie letters to pollies aslo how long do u see this going on 4....will the masters be off too..

cheers dude...

HellSpawn

23-06-2003, 05:42 PM

A sad day for paintball truly...
I hope we got over this...

HellSpawn

23-06-2003, 07:48 PM

time to get behind our local tourny's

minihux

23-06-2003, 07:51 PM

so was it these gun laws that are stoping the tourny.......???

or are u just stopping it because u r gonna try and change these laws..............

cause this suck this is so gay...................

ps.................i understand an im sure every one will try to help im just pissed of as i know many other people are but we will all help..................new gun no where to shoot it

peace minihux ( crying so hard his eyes are sore ) :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

minihux

23-06-2003, 07:54 PM

Originally posted by Blobby
what are the reasons for cancelation? hope no one had airfares booked .....

yeah what made u cancel the event...........it seem the APPL as good as it is and the best thing i have ever played seems to be a unreliable event.............for this year anyway

peace minihux

Jamie_Cracker

23-06-2003, 08:10 PM

Sorry guys but it was one of the hardest decisions we have ever had to make :( :(
We found that it was in he best interest to stop the tourny series as there are certain things going on that we have no control over and truly believe that not having these events at this stage is in the best interest of the paintball community throughout Australia:( :(
Us the commitee of the APPL as well as several others will be doing our utmost to get things rolling again but I cant say for sure when that will be or what the final outcome will be like:(
I cant go into the details just yet but rest assured your interests in paintball are the same as ours we dont make money out of it we do it cause we love to play APPL in stadiums against the best teams:(
Sorry again
BYE:( :(

Souse

23-06-2003, 08:45 PM

we had already booked airfares and accommodation. but this is not a problem, as we realise that the cancellation of round three, is in the best interests of all the players and the paintball community as a whole.

so to all the players who were so looking forward to round 3, keep the hunger going. hopefully the show will be back bigger than ever.

if you have booked flights with virgin, for a $30 fee they will hold the ticket in credit for 12 months. you can change destinations or transfer it to someone else if you want to.

Studio 54

23-06-2003, 08:50 PM

The APPL have done the only feasible thing in light of evidence that was presented to them.

Whilst this is disappointing for all, please be assured these guys had you and your equipment's best interest at heart.

I look forward to the resumption of a great series of tournaments.

I urge you all to contact JD or another APPL Board member to find out how you can best assist the cause.

Crow Eaters can send me a PM and I will give you the info you need.

schatts

23-06-2003, 09:24 PM

hmm I have heard a rumour and if it is true I will be pretty pissed off about it. Of course I will not spread the rumour here but I just hope we can change the laws for good so that this sort of thing cannot happen again.

Surely a case can be built on the WA judges findings that a paintball gun has not been made to penetrate the skin and therefore not a firearm as per the dictionary definition.

I would be willing to put money up in addition to joining the APPL to put this behind us, but what are our chances ?

We need to come together on this and not be decided state by state as I believe this is a federal law not state (is that correct?)

Jamie_Cracker

23-06-2003, 09:50 PM

I appreciate everyone's offer it is nice to see that the majority of players out there realise that we are not stopping this series for fun or profit but have the players interests at heart:D
Schatts I dont know our chances but we will give it our all and all the blood sweat and tears should make it better in the end:D
I am sorry to anyone that has lost out cause of airfares and the like but I think that everyone has lost out
:D

Rainman

23-06-2003, 10:04 PM

I can understand that you guys would be looking after our BEST interests.For anyone who wants to know the answers why,just knowThe APPL has all paintballers interests at heart.Thats what I am doing.And any help you guys need please keep it posted here and I will do what ever I can as a PLAYER and a VOTER of these FEDERAL POLITICIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I might move to RUSSIA or CHINA where they aren't such a democratic society.We are supposed to be living in the land of the lucky and the FREE, but I guess that isn't so.
These politicians MUST remember who VOTES them into POWER and WHO CAN TAKE THE POWER FROM THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If this is a DEMOCRATIC country, well maybe we'd be all better off with a COMMUNIST one instead.
This truly is a sad day not just for paintball, but for life in this country in general.I am going to go back to my corner and cry.......:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Jamie_Cracker

23-06-2003, 10:09 PM

um rainman russia is a democracy now:D

Rainman

23-06-2003, 10:22 PM

See I am not thinking straight now after hearing about the cancellations, but you get the drift of what I was saying anyway..........I hope.Well if you didn't, It feels like this country has turned COMMUNIST on us, who is looking after our best interests and for what???????????
We are normal people,holding down normal jobs,PLAYING A SPORT ,and the sooner these politicians leave the comfort zones of their offices,yeah the ones that US TAXPAYERS pay for and come and see that we aren't doing anything but playing a SPORT, the better off we, as VOTERS will be in my opinion.:hammer: :hammer: :hammer: :hammer:

Rainman

23-06-2003, 10:26 PM

What if ALL of the FIELD OPERATORS around this country started off petitions, and get every customer that came through their doors to sign, and then send it to our so called GOVERNMENT, do you think that it would be beneficial to our cause??????????
Just throwing up suggestions here...:hammer: :hammer: :hammer:

Jamie_Cracker

23-06-2003, 10:30 PM

What if all the field operators actually talked to each other:D
It may work we will have to see about it:D
um rainman why do you keep refering to australia as a communist state:D we are not that far along yet and by the way the commies killed all their leaders which were royals and installed a goverment of their own which worked out so well:eek: :D :D :D

Rainman

23-06-2003, 10:36 PM

Cause we vote for THE GOOD-HARD WORKING-HONEST PEOPLE and then they turn around and say that you can't do this and that, without even knowing what the hell they are talking about.And you email the Attorney General and you can't even seem to get a reply from him............:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Jamie_Cracker

23-06-2003, 10:45 PM

and that suprised you rainman,it is the nature of government and pollies to be that way getting upset and swearing wont fix the problem it will only make it worse if you wanna play the game you have to play by their rules cause they are the ones that make the decisions:D take it easy and calm down take a few deep breaths and everything will be alright:D calm now good just chill and dont let it get you upset we can do this if everybody pulls together:D
(and that wasnt ment the way it sounded sicko's):D

Dave

23-06-2003, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by schatts
We need to come together on this and not be decided state by state as I believe this is a federal law not state (is that correct?)

The import legislation is federal law, but the legislation about paintball itself is a part of each state's individual and varied firearms act. The changes in 1996 were only occured because howard persuaded the states to change their own legislation, the federal government has no power to make legislation with regard to how firearms are used.

I think that the best chance for paintball is to try to get it classified as something other than a firearm. While they are classified as firearms you sre always going to have problems with things like the 75cm rule, and other laws designed for REAL guns.
As much as I would like this to happen, i've got a feeling it won't :(

Naughty NINJA

24-06-2003, 03:04 AM

Sad day....understatement of the year.

My captain dropped the bomb at work tonight,heard a rumour about -=Edited by Bill=-.

RAINMAN,if they dont answer email..call them.
Customs was nice enough to pass these on to me the other week- ATTORNEY GENERAL: 02 6250 6730
email:firearms@ag.gov.au

Its late,but I work arvo shift and I will be sending an ema to the Attorney General before I hit the sack tonight...definitely.

EVERYONE, be confident that all will work out.
I mean....as far as I know,Paintball is recognised as a SPORT in NEW ZEALAND,officially as a SPORT!!
NO IMPORT RESTRICTIONS...a marker is a marker,they all do the same thing....mark ya with paint.

The DONT HURT or KILL people.

What is it that the KIWI's know that we dont??????

Somebody tell our Government...PLEASE!!!!

In the short time I have played on the tourney circuit I have met & played with SO many GREAT people....

We may PLAY with "guns",but the only hate out there is for dodgy equipment...the LOVE is reserved for All the people having SO MUCH FUN.....

Naughty Ninja,
PROUD APPL/SAPPA member.
PROUD PLAYER of the BEST SPORT on this round planet!!

Naughty NINJA

24-06-2003, 03:07 AM

Like I said....its late.

I will send EMAIL,not EMA...

R.I.P.S.

24-06-2003, 09:24 AM

Ladies and gentleman,

the enthusiasm coming from all of you to sort out the laws that restrict our great sport is fantstic but BE VERY CAREFUL who you contact and how you contact them, dispite the general feeling that if hundreds of people contact the parties concerned then we will make a difference, we will not!

I know there are a few out there that will not agree with me on this but in my opinion rather than everyone getting on the soap box and contacting the powers that be, you should get behind you local or national paintball organisation and get them to do the talking for you.

it is very easy to write a letter/email or to have a converstaion with these goverment people and have them catch you out or twist your words to then turn it against the sport and our cause.

the ANPF, APPL and other organisations have been dealing with the government departments for a long time now and know the right people to contact and the right things to say. it may not seem like it to you at the minute but we are making very good progress with things like this, by all means speak to your local MP's and even your local councilors but be careful how you do it, I and I'm sure anyone at the APPL will give you a few pointers as to who to approach.

get behind your organisation and keep on at them to keep you updated with the changes and progression of the project, this will not chnage over night but if we do it right. IT WILL CHANGE!

ONE carefully worded Letter or phone converstion by an organisation official can have much more effect then 10's or even 100's of letters and phone calls from angry and frustrated individuals.

please don't think I am trying to curb anyones enthuiasm or that I don't understand your frustrations, of course I do but lets make sure we do this right, one badly worded letter or conversation could set us back years... and none of us want that.

regards

Pete Martin

BIG P NZ

24-06-2003, 10:40 AM

only one way to fix this guys, ONE VOICE, stop working against each other and all go the same direction, maybe Martin the NZPPA will give some direction or help PM on Bills if need , cheers Peter

R.I.P.S.

24-06-2003, 10:54 AM

with respect BIG P, I dont think you are totally up to date with the situation over here at the minute...

A year ago they was some truth to your point about people working against each other but over the last 8 months many bridges have been rebuilt between people here in Aus between lots of different people.

I know that the APPL and the ANPF are both working toward the common goal and we are always keeping each other up to date with developments and we have a great working relationship.

things in any country and any sport will not always run like clockwork but I believe alot more people over here at the minute are at least keeping the same time...

I know everyone is together on this issue and if I made it seem like they weren't then I apologise.

Pete

Shagga

24-06-2003, 11:52 AM

Pete when you say "you should get behind you local or national paintball organisation and get them to do the talking for you."
Other than becoming a member what is there we can get non members (family, friends, etc.) to do to help??

On the point of "BE VERY CAREFUL who you contact and how you contact them", if any of us decide to contact them, then maybe some who knows good gramma and law should write up an email and/or fact sheet for those who aren't so good at putting their ideas in their own words, but if the "general feeling that if hundreds of people contact the parties concerned then we will make a difference, we will not!", so what is there exactly that anyone and everyone can do?:confused:

R.I.P.S.

24-06-2003, 12:28 PM

shaggar,

these of course are only my opinions but to support your organisation, yes joining is of course paramount and then talking to people and explaining the good that the organisation does and then getting more people to join... the more members any org. has then the more powerful its voice will become. also anything that you can think of or that you read or that you hear which you think could be useful to the Org. send it to them i'm sure they will be glad of the input and you may of seen or heard something they havent.

as boring and old fashioned as it sounds a well worded petition is a good way to put many peoples thoughts accross giving the MP or councilor only one letter to read but with so many signatures... it may sound very cliched but if you send an MP 200 letters about the same subject he will barely read a small percentage of them but one letter with hundreds of signatures can have a head turning effect.

saying that, I go back to my previous point of that if you can find an org. where you believe the people in charge are doing a good job then your efforts would be better placed finding more members for the org. and making their voice stronger.

as for contacting people as I said in my previous post, contact you local MP and discuss the matter with them... let me put it this way, someone earlier gave the contact details for the Attorney Generals office (and I am not having a go at that person, good on ya for trying to help) who in fairness is the office dealing with this matter however the way our democrcy works is that the more people wanting to change something the better but its all in the way in shich you do it that can have a larger effect.
You would have more effect convincing your MPs to do something about it.

I'm probably not explaining this well as I am sort of rushing it but at present you might get 200 people speak to one person in the Attorney generals office and that one person will relate your feelings to the AG. however many people call he will still only here it from one person.

if however you all contact your local MP's and for instance lets say that between us we contacted 30 MP's each of those MP's would be able to relay their thoughts to the AG.

So instead of hearing from one person in the AG's office that a few people are complaining and want change he is now gonna here it from 30 Members of parliment that a number of each of their constituents have approched them on the subject. This way we are still only talking about the same amount of people wanting it to change by the effect or message to the AG is alot more powerful.

I hope I explained this OK, if not let me know and i'll try again.

Pete

Knackers

24-06-2003, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by R.I.P.S.
shaggar,

these of course are only my opinions but to support your organisation,

Pete I understood this part, can you please explain in more detai the rest. as it is still a little cloudy for me. ;)

Seriously, good points

Dannefaerd

24-06-2003, 12:56 PM

Guys - don't know what's going on over there, but if reading between the lines is anything to go by then it doesn't look good.

If there is anything that the NZPPA (New Zealand Paintball Players Association Inc) can do to be of assistance please let me know.

It's is in our own interests to get things sorted over the ditch, our teams are most likely to want to travel to Australia as opposed to anywhere else ...

Personally I have to agree with Pete M above. You *HAVE* to work with the groups (APPL/ANPF/etc) ... that is what worked for us here - having an official body discussing the issues with the authorities worked *VERY* well for us.

Cheers
Martin
President - NZPPA, Inc.

Email: martin@paintball.gen.nz
Phone: +64 25 274 3231

RePete

24-06-2003, 01:51 PM

Bugger. News is travelling fast. Seems all the Kiwis are catching up with the goss.

Man I really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really feel stink for you guys. I can't imagine having to put up with what you guys do over there...:( Good luck getting it sorted.

Shagga

24-06-2003, 02:16 PM

In regards to contacting your local MP, what would I say and not say?
Our local MP is only 2 mins down the road and a mates old lady was the secretary in his office and now working in the office of another electorate! this may help! If I was to get a petition going could somebody word it for me?:help:

R.I.P.S.

24-06-2003, 02:36 PM

send me an email dude and I have a petition already prepared, i'll send you a copy.

I'll also come up with some points to use with your MP.

Email Me (info@ripspaintball.com)

Pete

Studio 54

24-06-2003, 04:02 PM

guys, please stop talking about form letters and petitions. leave them for the punters to sign at fields on rec days.

as tourny players, please take the time to write a personal letter to the attorney general and your local member.

form letters and petitions go in a pile to get answered by the work experience kid - trust me, i was a legal and political adviser for two federal cabinet ministers for a long time, i know what i'm talking about........as soon as any group started flooding our office with form letters, the issue got tagged a nuisance issue straight away.

i cannot urge you enough to make all your letters individual - IF YOU CAN THOUGH, SEND THEM TO JD AT THE APPL, TO BE FACT CHECKED. I KNOW ITS EXTRA WORK, BU WE HAVE ONE CHANCE TO GET THIS RIGHT!

R.I.P.S.

24-06-2003, 04:24 PM

Originally posted by Studio 54

form letters and petitions go in a pile to get answered by the work experience kid - trust me, i was a legal and political adviser for two federal cabinet ministers for a long time, i know what i'm talking about........as soon as any group started flooding our office with form letters, the issue got tagged a nuisance issue straight away.

B]

this is my point, which I why my suggestion is that rather than the attorney general if people want to write and complain to someone it should be their MP.

IMO

Pete

Studio 54

24-06-2003, 04:48 PM

i was just backing up your already wise words Pete;)

Jamie_Cracker

24-06-2003, 07:36 PM

thanks for all theguys that are offering support in what they can do.
pete and wade make some very valid points pete had been doing this for a while and wade obviously has been there done that with the pollies:D
thanks also go out to the kiwis for their support and offer to help
I myself dont exactly which way we are going to go or should go on the letters and stuff,we will have to have achat about it:D
anyway keep the feeling going and we will do all right iam sure:D :D

TYDDY

24-06-2003, 10:10 PM

Well here is my 2 cents. Letter to the g/a are a waste of time. they dont get that far. Hassle your local member.
If the laws only change section 12 so we can legally import semis that will be of little help to the sport.
So you can bring in any marker you want and it is cheaper. then what?.
You put up with the same crap laws that differ from state to state.
And in Vic you still got to have a shooter licence to play the freaking game. Police dont even have to have a shooters licence.
Unless you can change more than the import laws your just piss'n in the ocean.
Saying this i am aware you have to start some where.

eukanuba

24-06-2003, 10:46 PM

theres more to the issue than victoria dude..

what about the NT, W.A and Tasmania ?

oh, we dont count - because we are too far away...

jesus man, its more than just about importing paintball shit..

- Chris.

TYDDY

24-06-2003, 10:58 PM

That was my point dish licker.
Chris, less dog food more relax food.

eukanuba

24-06-2003, 11:05 PM

Dish licker ?

*nods head*

yeah.. no probs..

But only if the dish serves up fresh plates of pussy..

- Chris.

GAV WA

24-06-2003, 11:10 PM

ok ladies back on topic.
We haven't even got the full story of what has happened or what is about to happen in the next couple of weeks so all the talk about do this, do that seems pretty silly at the moment atleast. Shouldn't we just settle for two seconds.

Sikosis

25-06-2003, 11:35 AM

Just reiterating what's already been said - support the paintball organizations and they will work on your behalf.

I'd be happy to sign a petition, do a letter, whatever as I'm sure most if not everyone would.

I'm just waiting for the official word.

Cpt.Krunch

25-06-2003, 12:44 PM

Guys this is just a general thanks to all of you out their APPL members and non members alike for your support at this time. We know it's hard without knowing 100% why, but we've asked you to trust us that it's in the best interest of the sport and you have.:D

We've already heard positive news, but we're waiting for something in writing from a said government minister before we all get too excited.

Stay tuned, and dare I say it maybe even hold your breath.

JD

j3bu5

25-06-2003, 12:54 PM

You cant post something like that and not expect us to get excited about it!!! :)

well done and i look forward to hearing of this good news soon :D

Thanks for the update JD.

Yzo

25-06-2003, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by Cpt.Krunch

Stay tuned, and dare I say it maybe even hold your breath.

JD

will do. :D :D :D :D :angel: :angel:

Jamie_Cracker

25-06-2003, 07:25 PM

Keep holding Yzo I will let you know when you can let it out:D :D :D

ian

25-06-2003, 10:21 PM

Just a thought...When other people feel hard done by in this world ,they get together and have a rally to protest the law, and get good news coverage .
Would this be in our best interest to do this .?
We would get good news coverage, and show the people that our sport is short changed when it comes to being understood.
With the amount of passion we have I think we could get enough people together to stage one .
Any ideas.?:help:

Pompous Frog

26-06-2003, 05:46 PM

Well, much suckage.
Also, do you guys think it would help if the government had international pressure on this subject?
I could get some help from Pete Robinson and a bunch of the fellas from DYE industries not to mention players from American pro teams. This could help, and if you think it can tell me and I'll hook up my contacts again.

Pompous Frog

26-06-2003, 05:49 PM

One problem with rallies is that it might go the wrong way. Sure, when Moms Against Worms or something like that do a rally it seems fine because they don't seem harmful. People don't know much about paintball, and a rally won't educate them, they'll probably think "Gee, look at those reneck crackers.". Well atleast the consevative people will.
And the problem with media coverage is that you don't know what perspective they'll make you out in.

Cpt.Krunch

26-06-2003, 06:11 PM

Any overseas interest in playing competition paintball would be of great help. However, get them to contact the APPL first, so we can make sure the right things are passed on to the polies. We have to tread lightly.
As has been said before, politicians are the masters of twisting your words, one wrong comment and boom......straight to the bottom.

Stay united.

JD

BIG ROB

26-06-2003, 09:55 PM

OI, FROG, Watch who your calling a redneck!;)

schatts

26-06-2003, 10:35 PM

We might be able to get some financial help from overseas organisation, as it is in their best interests if the paintball scene was free of all the B#$#@!!t that is going around at the moment. Perhaps they can lend us their Lawyers lol....Pro-bono...lol

you never know.

JJJ

27-06-2003, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by schatts
hmm I have heard a rumour and if it is true I will be pretty pissed off about it. Of course I will not spread the rumour here but I just hope we can change the laws for good so that this sort of thing cannot happen again.

I think our sport needs to be very careful about "rumours". They are easy to start and some people or organisations can end up being easy targets.

I have heard at least 7 different rumours on why the series was discontinued and my advice would be not to pay any attention to these rumours until the facts are revealed. Nor continue them!

For SA paintball players:
I have, as a SAPPA committee person, spoken to the SA Firearms section and they are very happy with how paintball is going in SA; are not concerned about semi paintball marker ownership (as long as they are registered); are not working with the Federal Govt to impose any further restrictions; and would have no problem in allowing the paintball community to replicate the APPL Thebarton oval event again as they commented that it was extremely safe and "went better than they expected".

Remember that does not give SA players the right to import semi markers as that is a Federal issue.

Cpt.Krunch

28-06-2003, 04:01 PM

Schatts call me on (02)9679-0011. Your PM box is full.

Listen to DM, he is wise in the ways of legal mumbo jumbo.

JD

roo boy

28-06-2003, 04:53 PM

about 10 years back paintball markers were banned in Sweden. The Swedish gun laws are some of the most stringent in the world. The Swedish Government are a socialist government and are not very persuasive but after much persistance from the Field ops and Tourny players they ran some of their own ballistic test and decided to change the laws. The Paintball marker was re- classified not as a gun but as a toy!!!!!!!! Not sure that this helps us Aussies but surely there is hope!! Because as we all know 2 damage some1 badly with a marker u would have 2 hit them over the head with it. Oh well that is my 2 bobs worth.
:(

Cpt.Krunch

28-06-2003, 05:36 PM

Roo Boy you are spot on about how to hurt someone with a paintball marker that's for sure.

I supose these are the issues that bug us all so much.

1)Why this rabid need of Australian Politicians to classify paintball markers as some form of weapon eg, firearm, gun etc.? When the evidence is UNDENIABLE that they are more or less harmless.

2)Do we want our legislation to be inline with countries like China? Or do we consider our views more or less the same as countries like NZ and the UK?

3)Why is it our police departments use information from places such as Scotland Yard on a regular basis (they are the WORLDS LEADING BALLISTICS LAB after all), yet won't listen to what they have to say regarding paintball markers?

4)Lastly, what the f*#k is it the rest of the world knows that we don't?

Our politicians have not bothered to answer us satisfactorily in the past, prefering to just brush us aside. They can't keep doing this, because despite the restrictive laws, paintball is getting bigger in Aus, and becoming massive overseas.

Lets fix this once and for all.

JD

Deadeye

28-06-2003, 05:48 PM

you said it man:)

schatts

28-06-2003, 11:53 PM

Sorry Kpt. I have deleted some of my PM's should be ok now

schatts

29-06-2003, 12:04 AM

Well the SAPPA is still running its tourneys this year atleast, our team is reffing which mean no paintball tourneys for a heck of a long time. Damn.

vonsplatt

29-06-2003, 12:50 PM

Public demonstrations would be very dangerous . as some bent twit from the media could do with it ,as he wished. If anyone has a tame reporter ,who plays paintball, we can get controlled media outcomes ,without a demo.
I have been at demo's and watched the media coverage turn something quiet and boring, into something potentially violent. They often seem to feed , as a pack and tell the same story.I have chatted with reporters at demo's, who informed me they already had their "angle "worked out, before they arrived. They spoke in the "we" not the "I",so it was a group agenda setting.

Deadeye

29-06-2003, 05:34 PM

totally agree, protests dont seem to help public image for the lobbying group. Most times you see someone holding a prtest on the TV you yourself usually think that they are a pack of idiots or greenies (wait they are the same thing:hammer: )

vonsplatt

29-06-2003, 06:55 PM

Your search - "stupid greens" - did not match any documents

CHEEZAL

30-06-2003, 05:01 PM

Has anyone considered trying to get in contact with Andrew Denton?
He and Mick Malloy did have a day at Action Paintball,And if i recall When we used to Train as Maxx Wayne Pearce and Some of the Balmain boys were there as well.
Could we write to them or the Footy Show,which doesn;t just deal with Footy anymore, deals with all codes.
and See if we cant drum up some positive media support...
I believe we should enlist our o/s Paintballers,that've visited us here in Oz and played our game and try and drum up some o/s help from them..
Spread the word,and get them to start mailing Canberra or people we ask them to Target.
If we want to be able to mix it with the world ,let's appeal to them to help us.
Gibb and those Shock Ambassador's that did the Canada/U.S. tour how bout it,surely you met some teams you got along with...
Help spread the word..
Steve. (Cheezal)
Keep Paintball Alive Party.

Fly Angel

30-06-2003, 05:14 PM

Hey cheezal having a signature like yours doesnt help if your an outsider looking on this site man !!!!

Just a thought :respekt:

:angel: :angel: :angel: :angel: :angel:

Pompous Frog

01-07-2003, 12:39 AM

Well I'm getting the kids from Dynasty to sway to our cause.
Might look into some other teams. Hell, when the laws get changed we are definatly going to have to throw a massive tournament so they can all come and show us how to really play this sport!

MrNobody

01-07-2003, 06:52 PM

I'm reading this thread 8 Days after it was initially posted.

I haven't played ball for a while but I still love the game and to me this stuff kinda matters.

OK. Is the APPL REALLY doing this in the best interests of the player?

You are basing this on a still hidden premise: "Stuff we'll tell you about later"

WHAT IS IT?

Are we just talking about lack of uniformity in gun laws and crappy import laws for semis? Big deal. The tourney scene has been playing happily for years with these. No reason to stop a tourney there.

That is all you have disclosed. Is that it? What could be so bad that you can't disclose it publically?

OR

Are you just doing this to attempt to make a point to the government?

This is a crappy way of doing it. Noone in the government could care less if tourneys happen or not. Strikes only work when the striking group's absence causes the people they are trying to make the point to some pain.

The ONLY people you are affecting if you are trying to make a point is the players.

Well congrats you have affected them.

Now what does that achieve?

OR

(The cynical side of me comes out now)

Are you just doing it to manufacture a scare campaign to try to further the view of the APPL in the player community and maybe get new signups at $25 a head?

Well if my cynical answer is true then congrats, based on this thread it seems to have worked for at least a few players.

Seriously, I'm hoping that wasn't the correct answer but world events of late are leaving my pretty cynical about some authoritive figures. :-) (And no I don't know anyone from the APPL personally.)

If you honestly want to further the cause:
- Continue to play your game.
- Develop a strong paintball community that has a real voice in this country. This means selling, taking the stigma out of the game and making it desirable to participate.
- Get rid of the bulls&%t politics that ruins the game for people like me.
- Lobby the government using a strategic approach that will work. Plan it. Do it. It can happen. It simply needs some smart people with some experience in this kind of lobbying. Hint#1. Pollies don't like being called stupid.

Don't bother trying to guess who I am. There's very few of you who know me. I've been to your tourneys but you don't know me.

Rainman

01-07-2003, 08:23 PM

Blah Blah Blah MR Nobody...........put a name to your tag.............

schatts

01-07-2003, 08:24 PM

Mr nobody I know where you are comming from and respect what you say but your reply will probably be taken off as mine was.

I too want everything to come out in the open or a mail out to all the APPL members at the very least. Unfortunately the longer it goes on the more theories and rumours start, which cannot be good for the sport.

I do trust the APPL but would like them to trust the players enough to let them know what is going on............(sorry kpt. crunch I will try to call you sometime as you suggested.)

Crazy

01-07-2003, 09:02 PM

Although I only play in Qld( with a trip to NZ) I'm concerned about what may be happening and like everyone else I want to know what has made the APPL make this decision.

In the future I would like to play APPL tournaments and am loosing faith every week this does on.

Does it only concern the APPL or is it Aust wide and if that's the case have they told the other leagues?
If it's legal reasons then say so and I know I'll be happy.
If it' political pressure let us know and we can co-ordinate our response.
If it's any other reason what could be so bad that it can't be aired even to it's own members.

I'm not a member and won't be until this is sorted.
I missed schatts log that was deleted but don't think Mr Nobody's should be deleted as it his thoughts and although it may anger some people he didn't use any abusive language or use the lords name in vain.

When the APPL come to Brisbane again and this is in the past consider me there.

Your friend in the deadbox
Crazy

TTAM

01-07-2003, 11:00 PM

The appl is not doing this for its own reasons it is doing it in the best interests of players, i myself am bummed that it is not on but i will continue to support the best torney series in oz instead of slagging them without any idea of whats happening...

Bill

01-07-2003, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by MrNobody
[B]I'm reading this thread 8 Days after it was initially posted.

I haven't played ball for a while but I still love the game and to me this stuff kinda matters.

OK. Is the APPL REALLY doing this in the best interests of the player?

From my discussion with JD I would say its in the best intrests of paintball in general.

Are you just doing this to attempt to make a point to the government?

This is a crappy way of doing it. Noone in the government could care less if tourneys happen or not. Strikes only work when the striking group's absence causes the people they are trying to make the point to some pain.

Your correct in that it would be a crappy way of making a point to the govenment, however this is definatly not the reason.

Don't bother trying to guess who I am. There's very few of you who know me. I've been to your tourneys but you don't know me.
Theres no need to guess, we do comprehensive logging here + working for an ISP + evil admin powers lets me find info like that if need be :evil

Bill

01-07-2003, 11:54 PM

Originally posted by Crazy
Does it only concern the APPL or is it Aust wide and if that's the case have they told the other leagues?
If it's legal reasons then say so and I know I'll be happy.
If it' political pressure let us know and we can co-ordinate our response.

Yes is is Australia wide and not APPL.
The APPL have said that they will release a statement when they can.
If the info is leaked it could harm paintball (and not just the APPL) therefore,sorry, but no statement yet.
[/QUOTE]

schatts

02-07-2003, 12:37 AM

hey bill you can answer this for me then. If it is for paintball in general how come the supa air 5 man series went ahead ? and the local state tourneys are still being ran.

If it was that important to cancel round 3 how come these tourneys are still going ahead ??

It is just hard to understand how on one hand we cancel tourneys but on the other hand we still run them lol.....

Should these local tourney still be ran ? what are the risks ??

Frost

02-07-2003, 02:53 PM

Well this is the first i see from this post ... and i am shocked like many of us id imagine ... but i guess it had to come at some stage ... we have to fight for the right to play our game and expand our sport ... i am shure there is things we can do about it and we shall be victorious ... the main thing now is to concentrate our efforts and coordinate them correctly if we want to have maximum impact ... we have to have a clear idea of in which direction we have to go and what and when is the best time to do it . I am shure the APPL will lead the way effectively and no doubt we will achieve our goals..... IF we remail LOYAL and do things TOGETHER !

CHEEZAL

02-07-2003, 04:03 PM

PEOPLE! i dont know who has a chance to read todays newspaper.
(The Daily Telegraph July 2,page 2)inside it has an article headed CARR BACKS PISTOL SHOOTERS.
basically it says that premier carr is backing a new sport using pistols (which basically replicate's moving thru room to room hitting targets,as if at a crime scene against the clock )
With rumours of hand guns next to be banned,as well...
Why cant we use this acceptance of a sport on par with our own to approach MR CARR and try and lobby for our own sport.
Please Focus letters to your mps and to mr carr...
Sus out the article...please!!!
Cheezal

Blobby

02-07-2003, 04:12 PM

cheezal...are you talking about IPSC?...it has been around for long time.....the hand gun buy back is on now i think....

Cpt.Krunch

02-07-2003, 05:11 PM

Nice couple of questions Crazy. Bill seems to have answered most of them, but I'll elaborate.

As I have said in other places on this forum, yes it is a legal problem. Nothing has changed with the current laws, AND THAT"S THE PROBLEM. What has changed is the enforcement policy, if you will, of the federal police.

Why are local tournies going ahead? Think about the APPL tournies profile. We have to approach each states firearms registry to get permission to hold an APPL event at a stadium. You don't have to do that for the local ones. It's all about what they pay attention to and what they don't.

Our descision not to collect around 160 of our fellow tournament players and their expensive equipment in 1 well publicised convenient location, was made in your and their best interests.

Think about it. It's a Federal Police issue. What do the Feds and Customs control? It has nothing to do with gun licencing directly.

As has been said before, please have patience. When have further developements we'll let everyone know immediately. A lot of people are doing their best to salvage this situation, so please don't belittle their work.

Guys if you want to help fix the laws in your state, these are the people to contact.

QLD
Pete Martin 0421-802-821
Alex McLean 0412-106-558

NSW
JD (02)9679-0011

Vic
Martin Hammelman (03)9727-2002

SA
Wade Connelly 0429-900-499

WA
Andrew Heppekausen 0431-074-322

Cheers
JD